Philotic Web

Would anyone know if The Hive Queen and the Hegemon is a real book?
I'm just wondering because I think that book would be very interesting.

I remember the first time I read through the Speaker series. Every time it talked about how much someone revered The Hive Queen and the Hegemon, or referenced how it had become the equivalent of a classic piece of literature, I wished that it were a real book that I could read. I kept thinking that all of the characters referred to how relatively short it was--why didn't OSC just hammer it out real quick so we could all have a copy and be affected by it the same way that the Pequeninos were.

After I considered it for a while, though, I decided that The Hive Queen and the Hegemon shouldn't be written. If it were, it would lose its symbolic meaning. To me, the Hive Queen and the Hegemon is a mythical relic. Like Star Wars' lightsabers or Lord of the Rings' one ring, The Hive Queen and the Hegemon is a tool used by its Mythos to point to a truth deeper than could be revealed through the use of outright logical claims or even description of events.

A lightsaber isn't important because it is arguably the coolest weapon ever wielded by a sci-fi hero or villain. It's important because it reflects the incredible power behind a deeper understanding of how the universe works and what moves people. In one shade, it points to a life of true virtue that, though we try, many of us can never truly live. In another, it points to the incredible evil that can be borne of using the power of understanding for one's own benefit rather than the benefit of others.

The one ring isn't important because it makes you invisible but can also draw the black riders. The one ring represents the beauty and temptation of absolute power. It reminds us how often we fail to resist what we know is wrong because it can be so addictive to give in. The one ring represents (in the story) the greatest failure of humanity; one that the righteous must work together to overcome. And finally, it shows that even those in whom we stake the most trust can sometimes falter. Even the greatest of us need friends to help them up when they are feeling weak (Ender and Bean have a great deal in common with Frodo and Sam).

Which brings us to The Hive Queen and the Hegemon. The actual quality of the book itself is irrelevant. We don't need the book, because the existence of the book only serves to give the characters in the story what we have gleaned from being able to perceive all of their own experiences from an observer's standpoint. It is a symbol of one of the over-arching themes of Ender's story. The Hive Queen and the Hegemon serves to remind us what the characters of the EnderVerse are constantly trying to learn: It requires considerable patience and understanding to truly know someone, but once you have achieved that--once you truly know the experiences, and then the motivations, of a person's heart, how can you possibly have anything but deep compassion and love for them? And once you understand that all it takes to love someone is to grasp that there is more to them than you can perceive while being too securely rooted to your own point of view, why stay in such an immovable position? Uproot yourself and meet others from where they are coming. Most importantly, if you know that you would love each and every person once you understood their hearts, then why not skip the arduous process of learning everything about them, and love everyone now? We don't need The Hive Queen and the Hegemon. We already know what it says.

No joke, I love this answer.

Bravo. You put my thoughts and feelings down exactly as I would have if I had the writing ability.

Exactly. THQaTH is a plot device meant to move the story along. It is not a story that has tobe written because the point is to take your own interpretation from it. We know who wrote it, the style in which it was written and who it was written about and the motives for this. But we do not know how it was written, what words make it up, how it flows, how it evokes emotion. In that, we are in the dark, but to me, we are meant to draw our own conclusions as to how it is written.

Great answer. To provide another example, it's similar to why Locke's and Demosthenes' essays should never be actually written. We just believe that these, like THQatH, are the great pieces of writing that we are told that they are.

Very elegant. I agree completely. Please post more on other forums, I am interested to see your opinions in other matters.

No one here thinks it should be written? i mean that was a beautiful answer and i completely agree to a certain extent.

But, isnt anyone interested in seeing what Ender couldve possibly written about his brother who he only knew as an evil tormentor in his childhood, but who also later went on to become Hegemon and unite the world under one government. But Ender wasnt there for that. Did The Hegemon show any of Ender's true emotion toward Peter, or was it simply a biography?

And what about The Hive Queen? We know she is connected to Ender and that this connection somehow created Jane, but we don't know how. What did the Hive Queen tell Ender about the Formics? We know he knows them, feels horrible for destroying them, and wants to bring them back, but why? What did she show him that caused him to love so much the enemy he trained himself to hate so much during his years at battleschool? There's so much we don't know about the Formics. If the Hive Queen was written it would answer all these questions.

Also, The Hive Queen and The Hegemon is the basis for the Enderverse series especially Speaker for the Dead. Writing this book would bring a deeper meaning to the talks between the Hive Queen and the Father Trees. It would also tell us more about Ender's feelings towars his brother. Do they directly reflect the Peter II that comes out of Ender's mind?

So, maybe writing the Hive Queen and the Hegemon isnt such a horrible idea after all. maybe it would take away some of the mystery that lies behind the ring and the lightsabers and that special something in every science fiction series ever written. but, wouldnt it be nice to understand those mysteries?

i dont think they should be written because i dont think they could live up to our expectations

And what about The Hive Queen? We know she is connected to Ender and that this connection somehow created Jane, but we don't know how. What did the Hive Queen tell Ender about the Formics? We know he knows them, feels horrible for destroying them, and wants to bring them back, but why? What did she show him that caused him to love so much the enemy he trained himself to hate so much during his years at battleschool? There's so much we don't know about the Formics. If the Hive Queen was written it would answer all these questions.

This is wrong, I'm afraid, he spent most of his time in Battle School training himself to understand the buggers, which is far from hating them.

I am incredibly curious as to more of Peter's History, the Shadow series just didn't satisfy that thirst, but maybe it's better not to know.

Some of the most important parts of a series is the parts unwritten, the parts never seen. They leave it to imagination, and it becomes part of themselves, and everyone will have a different idea of how it's told, and what was in it.

didnt he only want to understand them because they always say you need to understand your enemy? sorry, maybe hate is the wrong word for that. so yes, understanding makes sense.

as for Peter's history, i honestly think The Hegemon should be written because it would explain why Peter II who was created by Ender while he was on The Outside is so evil and yet such a genius. this is the Peter that Ender knew as a little boy, but it's also partially Peter the Hegemon. the biggest question that would be answered if The Hegemon was written is: Who did Ender write this book about? The evil Peter who tortured him as a young boy, or Peter the Hegemon, creater of the FPE who achieved world peace?

My opinion:

I would love to read both books because I would love if 'Speaker for the Dead' was an actual position. Nothing would make me happier then to have someone speak the truth at my funeral.

Sure, if Ender could write them, I would love to read them.

Unfortunately, they would be written by OSC, whose writing has arguably deteriorated significantly from the time EG and SFTD were written. Frankly, I'd be really annoyed to read about how Peter's life was significant because he embraced heterosexual relationships blah blah blah gay marriage will kill us all.

who said anything about gay marriage? OSC created Ender therefore he created Ender's prospective so a book written by "Ender" would technically be written out of OSC's creation either way

Yes, but, like I said, OSC's writing has significantly deteriorated over time. To the point where all his characters serve as his mouthpiece for his political opinions (instead of being, you know, credible, realistic characters). So, instead of characters with compelling stories, we have characters with ridiculously long monologues on how the meaning of life is all about a happy heterosexual home. I don't mind if that's the character's story, fine. I kind of like happy heterosexual homes with parents and children. I intend to have one myself in a couple of years. But when that opinion gets in the way of characters and story, it's a problem. And, frankly, it drives away people like me who have thought through the issue, disagree, and don't like being preached at. People who, when they read a work of science fiction, want to be able to enjoy the characters and story and find it compelling in some way. People who like to lose themselves in books, so that the story and characters take on their own life, without continually having the author's presence and agenda grab their attention and remind them that it's just a book.

Any holy work he would write now, instead of credibly being written from the perspective of the character Ender (the fully empathic humanist agnostic) would somehow have Ender twisting everything around to be about OSC's favorite political points. If it weren't about gay marriage, it would somehow be about evil PC liberals.

I can't even force myself to pretend to be interested in his new work, honestly. I've more or less given up.

If he had written it twenty years ago, it might've been something to see. Probably, it still would have been a bad idea, just because trying to write what amounts to works of scripture is generally something where you are setting yourself up to fail. But if he were to do it now it would just be ludicrous.

I've said a number of times that I don't think that they should be (or even can be) written. Not because I have anything against OSC's writing, but because some things are better left to the imagination. How can any author set out to actually create works that are supposed to have the power to completely change the way humanity thinks? The books represent an idea; the notion that if an author can tell a story that is true and beautiful in the most profound sense people will feel it. It will resonate within them. It doesn't even matter if it is literally true or not. As science fiction writers often do OSC uses something that he can't actually show us in real life in order to explore a theme.

I completely disagree. I love nothing more than to read The Hive Queen, The Hegemon, and The Life of Human. It would be a masterpiece.

After reading these books, how can you claim that these things need to be left to the imagination? The entire point of the Speaker for the Dead was that he removed the illusions that blinded people to the truth, to reality. That at the end you told the true story, because that is the only story worth telling. The whole point was not in simply imagining some amazing, complex truth, love, justice, but in showing someone an analogy of that love, in their failures and their victories.

I'm sorry, but to me leaving it up to the imagination when I could have the chance to read it completely insults everything I hold dear about the Speaker for the Dead.


Archistrage

I love nothing more than to read The Hive Queen, The Hegemon, and The Life of Human. It would be a masterpiece.

Yes, you would love it, but only if it really was a masterpiece. If you love them so much, how would you feel if some writer went and wrote them the way he thought it should be, and it was completely wonderful to him, and he loved it, but to you it was not at all the way you imagined it, and you hated it. Would you seriously trust someone to write such magnificent works in real life? If you leave it up to your imagination, and I'm assuming you have one, The Hive Queen, The Hegemon, and The Life of Human really would be perfect to you. It would also be perfect to everyone else who loves it, and it would still be true. The fact that they aren't anchored in truth makes the whole thing true anyway you imagine it.

Oh, and by the way, welcome to PWeb.

But that's the point! I don't want it to be like I expect it. Where's the fun in that?

Remember in Speaker for the Dead, when he gives his speaking for Marcao and Libo. He didn't tell them everything that they knew, just to confirm in their hearts that Cao was a dog, and Libo was a saintly figure. In fact, he specifically said that was what he was not going to do. He told the truth, their sins and their savings; he told them what made him him.

And also, what do you mean if someone else just up and wrote it? Of course I wouldn't read it; it wouldn't be canon. Only OSC could write it of course.

And even then, you say that you want it to be a masterpiece. Again,I believe that rejects the whole point of the Speaker's task. It is not to write/speak elegantly/eloquently. It is about telling the truth, and letting it stand on its own so people can either accept it, or reject it.
So if your expecting the book to be a masterpiece written by God himself, then yes, you're in for a disappointment. Such a book could only be written by an imperfect man, about an imperfect man. Only then would it truly be the Hive Queen, The Hegemon, and The Life of Human.


Archistrage