Do you believe

[GodInYourEyes]

Do you think we, as a race will ever achieve world peace? Or is it just a dream we will never see while we are awake? Can anyone unit the world like peter did? Or do we have to fight each other until there is no one left?

[charles]

I think there is a middle ground to be reached. I don't think we'll necessarily fight each other into extinction, but I seriously doubt we'll ever stop the fighting. As long as there are people who have things and people who do not have things, violence will always be seen as channel for obtaining said things. It appears to be a natural reaction.

I'll tell you what. The moment we stop seeing violence in the animal kingdom, I'll believe we'll stop the violence amongst us.

This is, of course, barring an alien invasion.

[KennEnder]

Even if everyone had exactly the same stuff, there would still be fighting, because some people just want MORE (of whatever it is they value) than everyone else. Being equal is not acceptable to more than a handful of people, especially those who make the rules, run the corporations, fight the fights, ... yeah. Even in school, there is a competition for grades. Not just pass fail, right? So it is pretty much ingrained in us that people are not equal.

Not that there's anything WRONG with that...

[BonitoDeMadrid]

Wow. I'm the only one that replied "I believe" on the poll. That's..disappointing.

IMO, currently, there are a few sources of conflict that need solving; when they are solved, and humanity has gone through some steps to make sure the problems there don't rise up again, then the world will live in peace, and we'll be able to direct our attention to worse problems the human kind has got- diseases and whatnot.

To shorten it up, world peace's on our "To-Do" list. Right after squabbling about it so much.

[Darth Petra]

World Peace just a stupid dream of little kids and old women. It can never happen, and it will never happen, no matter how much anyone wants it. Humans are too stupid, evil and selfish for it to happen. There's too much sorrow and want for this to be possible.

[Oliver Dale]

Eventually all things will be peaceful. Once every chemical reaction has occurred, and every last non-fundamental particle has decayed, and existence has become nothing but a murky, cooling, cosmic soup.

Doesn't look so great for us, though.

[Wind Swept]

Mmm... Entropy.

A hive mind is the way to go if one wants to achieve world peace.

[anonshadow]

I think that life would be meaningless with complete peace.

[Rei]

Elena, by complete peace do you mean the absence of war between or within nations, or do you mean utter tranquility in every individual being?

[anonshadow]

Utter tranquility.

Well, not just utter tranquility. I think that there being some sense that everything could go to hell makes you appreciate life more. After a point, though, you cross the line too much and can't appreciate life at all because you're so full of anxiety.

[Dr. Mobius]

I never did vote in this poll. Don't really plan to either. It needs a middle-of-the-road option for fence-sitters like me. I doubt we'll ever reach the perfectly tranquil boringness, but we could certainly do with an improvement over the current state of world affairs.

[charles]

I never did vote in this poll. Don't really plan to either. It needs a middle-of-the-road option for fence-sitters like me. I doubt we'll ever reach the perfectly tranquil boringness, but we could certainly do with an improvement over the current state of world affairs.

I don't think anyone would actively argue against that...

[jotabe]

I believe.

There are evidences all around: after people have a relatively high freedom, and a relatively high standard of living, the urge to fight, or the tendence to believe in something so blindly that compels you to kill whoever disgrees, is greatly lessened.
We become more complacent, more jaded, true, but our higher appreciation for our great comfort takes away the appeal of violence.

Look at western Europe (and i don't say they whole Europe because of Yugoslavia). After centuries, millenia almost, of uninterrupted wars, the possibilitiy of an internal bellic conflict (whether it is war among european countries or civil war) is basically laughable (there are still problems, though like local terrorist groups).
The same can be said about North America, which was the soil for long and bloody wars in the past.
SouthAmerica is still in a bit of turmoil, but there hasn't been wars between countries in decades. And civil wars/putschs are almost something of the past. A lot of problems, yes, but definitely getting better.

Why can't this condition expand all over the world? Would it be so strange that countries, as they reach goverments that grant a number of social, politic and economic freedoms, conclude that war is simply a waste of time, money and human lives?

Btw, good to be back I finished reading Shadow of the Giant, and well, i had to come

[charles]

I think Africa is pulling it's fair share of problems to make up for Europe's currently subdued nature.

[anonshadow]

And never mind that most of the problems that are going on elsewhere in the world were caused by Europe and continue to be caused by people who live IN Europe.

[jotabe]

I agree that many of the wars in Africa have their causes rooted in the (bad) colonization, and in the (even worse done) decolonization process.

But how is that nowadays most problems elsewhere in the world are caused by people who live in europe?

And how does this relate to the possibility or impossibility of extending the peace that exists in the western world + Latin America to the rest of the world?

[anonshadow]

Because people in Europe (and the US) are the ones who own a lot of the companies that underpay the workers in third-world countries.

[jotabe]

That i can agree, in a way. Because i think it's more the governments at fault than the companies. The companies keep the wages low because since the western governments artificially inflate the prices of the products that come from those countries, it's the only way to be competitive.

Also, think about the countries that have receiving in the past foreign companies attracted by the possibility of paying low wages: examples are Spain, Portugal, Ireland... It hasn't exactly been bad for us, on the long run. The difference is that there is free trade among the countries in Europe, while we do not allow free trade with the rest of the world.

In any case, when it comes down to wars, wars in Africa and Asia, as of lately, haven't been been servile ones. They have been tribal and ethnic wars, and often with the control of natural resources in the background. And with totalitarian regimes (or would-be totalitarian regimes, like many rebel groups opposing those governments).

[anonshadow]

People start wars when they're desperate, and they're desperate because they're in economic depression. However you want to skew it, jota, Europe contributes to all of these wars. Most of the countries they're screwing over just don't have the ability to take the war to them.

[jotabe]

No, people don't start wars when they are desperate. They might start upraisings, and even that doesn't happen often.

It's people with greed of power who start the wars, and they feed on people who are desperate to increase their numbers. But not only on people who are desperate, also people's racial prejudice, national pride, religion, etc. Look at the wars in Somalia, Nigeria, Sierra Leona, Iran-Iraq, Rwanda... what were the elements that called people upon arms? Racial hatred, religion... And what were they about? metals, diamonds, oil...

[Dr. Mobius]

This seems fitting enough for the topic:

Strive for your next breath. Believe that with it you can do more than with the last one. Use your breath to power your capacities: capacity to kill, to maim, to destroy.

And just where do your capacities come from? Why do you always go where I want and do what I say?

Perhaps you're just running a fool's errand, doing everything as I've planned, never able to change your course....

Or, perhaps, that is not the case.

Perhaps, you are doing what you were meant to do. Your human mentality screams for vengeance and thrives on the violence that you say you can hardly endure. Your father told you as a child to always fight with honor, but to always fight. Do you care about honor, or do you use honor as an excuse? An excuse to exist in a violent world.

Organic beings are constantly fighting for life. Every breath, every motion brings you one instant closer to your death. With that kind of heritage and destiny, how can you deny yourself? How can you expect yourself to give up violence?

It is your nature.

Do you feel free?

http://marathon.bungie.org/story/durand ... %20Quiddam

[jotabe]

Then, how can there be ample areas of the world, not so long ago, historically speaking, wartorn, where nowadays the idea of war is quite ludicrous for most people?
And even if a strike of bad luck could change that, if people thinks that war happening in these territories is a laughable notion, what about their inner violence that seems to be threatening to take over their intelligence and sense of comfort at a moments notice?

Edit: seeing my number of posts, i feel tempted to stop posting

[zeroguy]

Then, how can there be ample areas of the world, not so long ago, historically speaking, wartorn, where nowadays the idea of war is quite ludicrous for most people?

Because he's quoting from a video game (or is this fanfiction? I can't really tell). Bungie may do a lot of things well, but I don't tend to go to them for philosophy.

[GodInYourEyes]

what about evolution?
can we evolve to become peaceful?
find yourself a peacefull person and get marryed!
in 20 million years we will have world peace

[Wind Swept]

Or the world will be in pieces.

[hive_king]

I don't think that the world will ever be united, if anything it seems to me the path is in many smaller nations, but there is at least the possibility that eventually the global economy will work for everyone, at least enough to keep their needs met. Once this happens, coupled likely with ethnic groups fragmenting into their own small nations, there may not be total peace, but it'll be closer than we are now.

[jotabe]

Precisely, breaking up into small nations might be a step into the creation of large international organizations, that could be as tight as the US, or as loose as the EU.
These internationals organizations would arise not due to the dominance of one nation over others (like the old European empires, Warsaw pact, etc), but as the result of nations being so small and weak, that they realize the need to band together (like US and EU).

When most nations would be used to give up part of their sovereignity to larger structures in order to achieve a better management of resources, it wouldn't be hard to think of a world common superstructure.

But certainly a lot earlier than this, wars would be something almost forgotten, i predict.

The biggest difficulty is the reluctance of old large countries to let themselves be broken up to be rejoined later on.

[eriador]

Peace isn't a human trait.

Yeah, I'm a cynic, but what can you do about it?

BTW, Shouldn't this be in ReMoPhi?