Superman vs Batman

[Hegemon]

In the left corner, weighing in at 230 lbs we have the Man of Steel, Krypton's last son, SUPERMAN.

and in the right corner, weighing in at 220 lbs, the scourge of Gotham's criminals, the dark knight detective, BATMAN.

*dingdingding*

[Jebus]

One word: Kryptonite.

Superman would get bitch-slapped.

[mr_thebrain]

agreed. if there was any way to find or purchase kryptonite, batman would do it well before the fight. he's just mean and brutal and dark, and screwed up enough to succeed in using it to finish off superman once and for all.

superman is too goody-goody to be a proper character.

[suminonA]

One word: Kryptonite.

This way, even a toddler would defeat Superman. So what’s the poll about? Superman vs. Kryptonite? We all know the answer to that.

In a fight based on physical strength the Super would defeat the Bat any day.

A.

[Hegemon]

One word: Kryptonite.

This way, even a toddler would defeat Superman. So what’s the poll about? Superman vs. Kryptonite? We all know the answer to that.

Then how do you explain all the numerous villains who have had kryptonite and failed to do him in? At some point or other Lex Luthor, the Cyborg, Darkseid, the Kryptonite Man and a million other villains have had access to kryptonite.

Just because someone can get ahold of kryptonite, it doesn't me he wins automatically.

[powerfulcheese04]

I vote Batman.

The ultimate boy scout could beat the lucky guy.

[suminonA]

Then how do you explain all the numerous villains who have had kryptonite and failed to do him in? At some point or other Lex Luthor, the Cyborg, Darkseid, the Kryptonite Man and a million other villains have had access to kryptonite.

Just because someone can get ahold of kryptonite, it doesn't me he wins automatically.

Well, according to the latest Superman Movie, Lex Luthor managed to stab Superman with a Kryptonite blade and then what?
*SPOILER*
Super goes to the bottom of the ocean.
If it weren’t for his friends (Lois in this case), he’ll be dead.
*/SPOILER*

So, if there is nothing more in the ring but Super and Bat with a Kryptonite blade, it’s all over. And you can replace Bat with anyone if you want.

A.

[Hegemon]

Well, supes has been stabbed by a bunch of kryptonite things without it killing him... even a few kryptonite bullets... with or without friends he tends to make it back.

Incidentally, that assumes that they are in fact in a ring to begin with... i know i made it sound like a boxing match, but that was just cuz it sounded like a good intro.. incidentally, as i recall, in your reference he was already weakened by residual kryptonite radiation in his surroundings... which is why the thugs were able to stomp the s*** out of him before stabbing him.

[Jebus]

But now that I think about it, using Kryptonite perhaps isn't fair, in the same way that injecting Batman with a serious illness before hand wouldn't be fair.

Edited to avoid a pun.

[suminonA]

Incidentally, that assumes that they are in fact in a ring to begin with... i know i made it sound like a boxing match, but that was just cuz it sounded like a good intro.. incidentally, as i recall, in your reference he was already weakened by residual kryptonite radiation in his surroundings... which is why the thugs were able to stomp the s*** out of him before stabbing him.

So, is this "Superman & Friends" vs. "Batman & Co"?
Bruce's fortune would allow Batty to prepare all the Kryptonite he wants, so we should allow Super to inject poison in his opponent, as Jebus notes.

It gets then to a moral fight (who gets as low as being unfair, first)? Then I'd think it's all about the stake of the fight…

Now that I mention it, why are the two POSITIVE heroes fighting against each other ?:D

A.

[mr_thebrain]

batman ain't all lollipops and daisies here guys. fair fight? come on. batman is halfway to being a villain himself. i think he'd be more than willing to use kryptonite to win the fight.

batman and superman don't really get along. so i think a fight between them is fitting.

[suminonA]

Superman isn't that good either. See the "Superman vs. Superman" movie. (Incidently, guess who won that fight )

If they really get into fighting each other, Super has greater strength. Plus, he flies without all thost gadgets Bat has.

(Note: I really like Batman, even more than Superman, because he is more credible in the incredible land. But the facts are on Super's side here...)

A.

[anonshadow]

Batman.

In terms of pure strength, yes, Superman has him beat by a mile--but Batman is a hell of a lot smarter than Superman, and he's a lot more ruthless. On some level, Superman is really about a fair fight, and there are some things that I just don't think he'd do.

Batman, on the other hand, is not about fighting honorably. He is about winning the fights that he needs to win. He has examined Superman and found every weakness he can, I would be willing to bet, and he would be willing to do whatever it took to make sure that Superman was brought down.

The only thing that makes me doubt that Batman would win is his aversion to killing, but if he thought it absolutely necessary, I'm pretty confident that he would.

... I feel like a geek...

[suminonA]

The only thing that makes me doubt that Batman would win is his aversion to killing, but if he thought it absolutely necessary, I'm pretty confident that he would.

That's just it. If you manage to convice Batman that killing Superman is worthwhile, then it is possible to convince Superman of killig the Bat.
Given the same willingness, Superman wins, doesn't he?

A.

[anonshadow]

The only thing that makes me doubt that Batman would win is his aversion to killing, but if he thought it absolutely necessary, I'm pretty confident that he would.

That's just it. If you manage to convice Batman that killing Superman is worthwhile, then it is possible to convince Superman of killig the Bat.
Given the same willingness, Superman wins, doesn't he?

I don't think so. I think that Batman is a more ruthless person, and has no inherent sense of needing to play fair. Superman, even when he needs to win, seems to. Superman is the original boy scout, while Batman is a ruthless hero. He knows Superman's weaknesses far better than Superman knows Batman's, and he is always prepared.

[Jebus]

Maybe I've misunderstood Batman, but I've always seen him as being just as honourable as Superman. He may be gruffer and angrier, but when the villain is dangling above a long fall, he reaches out the hand to save him every time.

[Hegemon]

Batman is even more averse to killing than Superman is. Superman executed 3 people who were depowered and unarmed. Batman can't even bring himself to kill the Joker who has killed a Robin, crippled a Batgirl and even kill Jim Gordon's wife.

Batman is totally a hero. He is darker and uses fear to win, but there is absolutely no grey area with the man. He is a hero through and through.

As for who would win.... Technically it depends on who's book it is in, haha.... In Lex Luthor: Man of Steel, Batman had his chunk of kryptonite and Superman handed him his ass without breaking a sweat. In the first Superman/Batman storyline, a superman from the future also kicked the s*** out of Batman, when Batman had his kryptonite ring.

Superman basically has 4 weakenesses, 3 of which Batman can likely exploit and 2 of which might be applicable should Batman and Superman ever get into a fight... Batman is very capable, but unless Superman is playing fair as he usually does, he won't have a chance. In the Hush storyline he admits that the only reason that he could ever beat Superman is because Superman is inherently nice and doesn't use his abilities to their full extent.

For instance, assume batman has a big chunk of kryptonite... what is to stop superman from frying him from the stratosphere? Or dropping a mountain on him? Or flying towards him at 0.9c and utterly obliterating batman, and then having his momentum take him past the kryptonite?

Batman will win, but only because Superman as he is is too damn nice. The moment Superman stops playing nicely, Batman wouldn't have a chance.

In case any of you are wondering, between the two characters, Batman is my favorite.

[Qing_Jao]

Superman has the strength, but Bats has the dexterity. If Supe can't land a punch, then it doesn't hurt. It'd be close, but barring kryptonite, I think Superman woud eventually win. If it was in a closed room with no available exits. Otherwise, Bats has another advantage.

[suminonA]

I think that Batman is a more ruthless person, and has no inherent sense of needing to play fair. Superman, even when he needs to win, seems to. Superman is the original boy scout, while Batman is a ruthless hero. He knows Superman's weaknesses far better than Superman knows Batman's, and he is always prepared.

Ok, let's talk in practical terms.
Batman can hardly keep the city of Gotham under control. He is just a man with gadgets.
Superman can hold on the entire planet Earth. (He can even reverse time by reversing the rotation of the planet?!?!?)

So, given those facts, if Superman has to choose who will die, Batman or himself, what would he choose? As he is thinking in the best interest of the humans, he will choose to dispose of the "Dark Knight".

So there you have a moral obligation/reason to prevent him from dying. Even with his limited intelligence (as you are insinuating he is not also super intelligent) will realize. And if that mans that Batty has to die, so be it.

A.

[eriador]

Superman wins. He actually has super powers. Nothing that Batman has rivals that (it's the sad truth).

[mr_thebrain]

to add to my case, superman is a lame superhero. out of all the popular superheroes, i find that superman is the one that's least interesting. he deserves to die.

[eriador]

I agree, but he would still win.

That's (part of) why he's lame.

[suminonA]

to add to my case, superman is a lame superhero. out of all the popular superheroes, i find that superman is the one that's least interesting. he deserves to die.

Oh, so in your case it's a personal vendetta against Super?

Don’t worry; he is not interested in buying people’s souls.

A.

[mr_thebrain]

superman wouldn't stand a chance against me. so no, not a vendetta, i just don't like the character.

[suminonA]

I'm sorry, it's just that your not so veiled desire to see him dead smells to me as a wish to eliminate the concurrence. Why are you afraid to give away the monopole on absolute power?

A.

[mr_thebrain]

you mistake my mean spiritedness for fear?

lol i like you, you're a funny little human!

[neo-dragon]

I gotta say that Batman would probably take him down. First of all, I recall reading that it was revealed in some comic that due to his paranoid nature, Batman had extensive files on every member of the Justice League, including their weakness (well, everyone knows Superman's) and plans for how to take them out if they go rogue. Furthermore, I think that it's considered DC canon that Batman keeps kryptonite on hand for just such an eventuality.

Also, has anyone ever read Frank Miller's "The Dark Knight Returns"? In it, an aged Batman defeats Superman using his ingenuity. I think he did use kryptonite to some extent, but he relied mainly on a custom made exo-suit to enhance his strength, sonic blasts that were murder on Superman's super hearing and screwed up his equilibrium, and hitting him with the city's whole power supply all at once. Granted, Superman was weakened somewhat from a nuclear blast he had recently endured, but the fight really showed how Batman could use his brain to level the playing field.

Nonetheless, if Superman were to go all out, probably nothing short of God Himself could stop him, but Superman ALWAYS holds back because he's afraid of what he could do unintentionally. If he wanted to kill Batman he could, but trying not to kill him is what would cost him the fight, because nothing short of death can stop the Dark Knight! Well, a broken back did slow him down for a while...

[eriador]

Well, based on what you said, Batman will not go rogue, because he seems to responsible (keeping files on everybody to prevent them from doing so). If this is true, that means that for Batman and Superman to fight, Superman will have gone bad, which means that he will not worry about going all out. Therefore, Superman wins.

[Jebus]

The problem with the article I read that sparked this thread was that it assumed that one of the superheores would have to go bad in order for two goodies to fight. It put forward the idea that Batman would obviously go bad due to his traumatic childhood and dependance on money. This seems to me to be a very childish way to look at things. It's entirely possible that Superman and Batman could fight each other while both remaining good if they both believed what they were doing was right and what the other was doing was wrong. On top of this, if we take one as turning bad, we are changing the characteristcs of the superhero in a way that makes it irrelevant to the original discussion.

[neo-dragon]

It's entirely possible that Superman and Batman could fight each other while both remaining good if they both believed what they were doing was right and what the other was doing was wrong.

Again, read "The Dark Knight Returns" by Frank Miller. It shows a future where Batman returns from retirement and has to confront Superman, who is a government lap-dog. Both believe that they are serving the people. It's quite an interesting graphic novel. It was required reading for my sci-fi/fantasy course in university.

*edit*
Actually, I think that a more interesting superhero fight would be Batman vs. Spider-man. Consider two scenarios: one in which they are both familiar with each other's abilities and are prepared to fight, and one where they just cross paths and do battle with no prior knowledge. I think that Batman would win the former and Spidey would win the latter.

[Jayelle]

Dark Knight Returns is great and all, but you could also read JLA: Liberty and Justice where the future contains Bruce becoming Godfather to Clark's child. It's all what you read.

I think Superman would win.

Batman is smart. He knows that the world needs Superman. Unless we're talking about Superman going rogue (which, I agree with Jebus, it isn't), Batman knows that Superman is the ying to his yang. The world needs vigilanteas well as out and out heroes.

Superman is necessary in order for Batman to even exist. If the government knows that Superman is trustworthy and has an amiable relationship with him, then Batman can reap the benefits. If the world trusts superheros because of Superman, then the world trusts Batman.

Does any of that make sense?

[Jayelle]

Double post:

No Spiderman vs. Batman. Marvel and DC stay separate. Boo for crossovers.

[eriador]

I like bat vs. spider. I agree with neo_dragon on that one as well.

[LilBee91]

Since the original question seemed to imply a friendly match, I say that Batman would win. Superman wouldn't be too excited to use his powers to their greatest extent for just a little bout. However, if they were to duke it out to the death, Superman would probably end up winning--his strength has more endurance (I think).
I still voted for Batman though. He is so much cooler.
Bruce would massacre Clark.

What would be really sweet is Superman vs. Wolverine (but that is DC/Marvel, and apparently blasphemous).

[anonshadow]

Ok, let's talk in practical terms.
Batman can hardly keep the city of Gotham under control. He is just a man with gadgets.
Superman can hold on the entire planet Earth. (He can even reverse time by reversing the rotation of the planet?!?!?)

Superman definitely struggles with keeping even just Metropolis under control at times, but I take your point. However, I don't think that the area each is capable of defending (and chooses to defend) is indicitive of who would win in a fight. Batman can hold his own against Superman, and has on several occasions. He may not be able to zip around the globe using superspeed, but he can definitely cause damage when he has to--against whoever he has to.

So, given those facts, if Superman has to choose who will die, Batman or himself, what would he choose? As he is thinking in the best interest of the humans, he will choose to dispose of the "Dark Knight".

Uuum... I don't think so. And even if Superman did make that decision consciously, I'm still not sure he would give the fight everything he could. He has too inherent a sense of fair play, I think, where Batman--hero though he may be--doesn't.

Physically? Yes, Superman could rip Batman apart if it came to it.

Mentally? I don't see him being able to engage in such an unequal fight.

So there you have a moral obligation/reason to prevent him from dying. Even with his limited intelligence (as you are insinuating he is not also super intelligent) will realize. And if that mans that Batty has to die, so be it.

I'm not saying that he's not a very intelligent man, but...

Batman is smarter. Plain and simple. Batman is smarter, and Batman is more prepared.