Death penalty for serious criminal offenders

[Eaquae Legit]

Yeah...that's true...although when it is the powerful and rich who blame an innocent, it will be difficult for him to get out...

All the more reason not to kill him.

There are many people who deserve the death penalty.

Perhaps, but I like to think that we're better than that. And if they deserve it, we still have no right to do it.

[Rei]

I think I'd like to re-affirm what was said earlier, than what makes us human is the treatment of others as being human. As soon as we stop treating even the worst humans as humans but instead as animals, we are stooping toward their level. Sure, executing Pol Pot would not be equal with what he did, but it would be a step closer than we need to be in order to achieve the same effect of punishing him and ensuring that he will not try for a second round.

[Eaquae Legit]

Bumping this in light of Saddam's impending execution.

For the record, my feelings haven't changed. I'll be sad when he is killed. Not because I like Saddam, but because killing is sad.

EDIT: I am sad.

[AnthonyByakko]

Don't be sad - he was sentenced to death in 1960 anyways. Somebody just finally got around to doing it.

[Rei]

What gets me is that there was apparently an hourly count-down of sorts on the radio. I mean, how sick is that?

[luminousnerd]

The appeals and whatnot end up more expensive than feeding them for life.

But all of that money goes back into our economy. Food for undeserving criminals does not. Also, the way justice is handled is ridiculous in my opinion. All of the appeals are just total bullshit.

This brings me to another problem with execution. There is a chance that an innocent person could be executed. This would be an amazing failing of the justice system. There have been cases of new evidence coming up and people being let off of death row.

I am only for the death penalty in instances where it is inconceivable that the person did not commit the crime. With Osama bin Laden, we know he's committed the crime, we've seen him, etc etc. There's not any possible way he didn't commit a crime. He deserves to die. Or rather, he doesn't deserve to die, but death is the most humane of choices for proper justice.

[Rei]

If I recall correctly, the trickle-down theory was a complete flop. The money stayed in the hands of a very few and never made it back to the tax-payers.

[AnthonyByakko]

Luminous is confusing "our economy" with "our government." It's a common misconception among right-leaning people.

[Rei]

I'm right-leaning. I think you mean further-right-leaning. Afterall, the American political spectrum is right-wing and further-right-wing, isn't it?

[AnthonyByakko]

I'm right-leaning. I think you mean further-right-leaning. Afterall, the American political spectrum is right-wing and further-right-wing, isn't it?

To the detriment of us all, yes.

[luminousnerd]

Okay, you're right. But my contention is that the system needs to be redesigned so that doesn't happen

[Julius Caesar]

What gets me is that there was apparently an hourly count-down of sorts on the radio. I mean, how sick is that?

Yeah...but remember that the media did not really care about Saddam Hussein-they just thought "yei! more rating!"

Getting back to the death penalty...what about police shooting at criminals?

[Rei]

I tend to see killing in the midst of a fight as a tragic result. When someone is shooting at you, it is generally considered fair play if the law enforcers are allowed to shoot back. And if someone dies in the process, well there were bits of metal flying all through the air from both directions and it could have happened to anyone. Tragic, to be sure, but far different from execution.

[luminousnerd]

Getting back to the death penalty...what about police shooting at criminals?

I f****** hate cops.

[Rei]

Yeah! People who enforce the law suck and are evil!



I happen to think we need them and part of why I like Canada is that far fewer people carry guns meaning shoot outs with the police are less likely to happen and thus, fewer people accidently killed by the police.

[anonshadow]

A few jumbled thoughts:

I generally oppose the death penalty, but it bothers me when people misrepresent it. Saying that executing Saddam Hussein (for example) will turn someone into a murderer is, in my eyes, absolutely preposterous. I think that there is a huge difference between murdering someone and flipping the switch by the will of the jury, the judge, and the law of your country. Similarly, it bothers me that people will accuse the executioner of being a murderer, but never the judge--who did the sentencing in the first place!


If a cop shoots at a person who will not stand down and if either inflicting or preparing to inflict bodily harm on someone else, then I think that is perfectly justified. Does it suck that that happens? Absolutely. Are the police unjustified? No. It gets shadier when they are simply in pursuit of a person they know to be a criminal--my answer to whether that is wrong would depend largely on what kind of crime the person had committed, and on what scale.


A friend of mine made a point that I found interesting:

Many people we were discussing Saddam Hussein's death with were denouncing the death penalty. She pointed out that many of the same people told people who are pro-life that they should be tolerant and support a woman's right to choose, yet they were intensely intolerant of killing and murder once it crossed into the realms of what they considered to be such.

It's an interesting point.


And on the topic of Saddam Hussein's death: F*ck, but I am tired of hearing people whining about how the only reason Hussein was executed is that Bush had it in for him. The trial didn't even take place in the US, and if it had? Bush still wouldn't have been the one doing the sentencing!

I'm also tired of people not speaking ill of the dead. The bad things he did didn't actually go away when he died.

[jotabe]

just my 2 cents:
I am against death penalty, for several reasons and at several levels.
But Hussein's case is probably the worst example to be against it.

[luminousnerd]

"The evil that men do lives after them, but the good is oft interred with their bones"

Brutus (Shakespeare)

It's quite true.

[Rei]

Not always, it isn't. Often the exact opposite. It all depends on if people liked you or not.

[luminousnerd]

Not always, it isn't. Often the exact opposite. It all depends on if people liked you or not.

You do have a point there, I suppose. Yea, definitely. You've persuaded me. JFK is a prime example.

[Fish Tank]

Eye for an eye.

[jotabe]

An eye for an eye, we will all end up blind.

[Andorbal]

An eye for an eye, we will all end up blind.

I like that. Was that you, or did someone else say it?

I personally have to abstain from voting because I can't make up my mind on the topic. I think that I personally believe that it certain circumstances the death sentence is warranted, but then there are arguments against it that I have no answers for. Because of that, I can't really be completely behind it...

Andorbal.

[jotabe]

Nope, it's not mine.
I think it is Gandhi's, maybe not word by word.
Lemme check...
Yeah, Gandhi's:
"An eye for an eye and soon the whole world is blind."

[Andorbal]

Gandhi... Is there anything that guy couldn't do?

[jotabe]

Yes, keeping India united and abolishing the chaste system. He tried, but not even him could succeed against religious fanaticism.

[Jebus]

Get into heaven, apparently.

[Eaquae Legit]

Yes, keeping India united and abolishing the chaste system.

Oh, those chaste Hindus! Why do they reject the joys of orgy?!

Just teasing, Jota. The spelnig made me smile.

[jotabe]

lol... that would be strange, after all, Kama-sutra is their creation

[London]

I don't understand how government officials who claim to be Christian can possibly be in favor of blatently "sinful" actions.