Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

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Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby ash » Thu Dec 29, 2011 6:00 am

Ho,

So, I just finished Ender's game (the novel, not the short story), and am wondering what is next?

I've heard that Ender's shadow follows quite naturally as it covers around the same period (battle school and beyond). But, Speaker for the Dead seems to be the next published novel, right?

Which one should I really be reading? Does it matter?

Also, the novel rocked. Ender's awesome. I'm sure I'll love the series.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Luet » Thu Dec 29, 2011 7:50 am

You can go either route. Personally, I would read the Speaker series first since that's how he originally wrote them (and I like them more). Then you can go back and read all of the Shadow books to prepare for Shadows in Flight which is being released next month.
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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby ash » Thu Dec 29, 2011 8:25 am

Sorry, I couldn't wait and am already a couple chapters into Shadows! I did read like half a chapter of Speaker For The Dead... I don't know what to do. I think I might end up taking your advice. :)

Either way, I don't think I'll be able to get through everything before the next release.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Petra » Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:51 am

Trust Luet! Go with Speaker!
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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Luet » Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:19 am

:mrgreen:
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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby UnnDunn » Mon Jan 02, 2012 9:11 pm

I'm actually of the opinion that Speaker, Xeno and Children should be read separately as its own little miniseries.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Peter Wiggin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:24 am

I would read Ender in Exile next. It follows the logical progression, even if the book is only so-so.

The Speaker trilogy stands on its on and it very (and disappointingly) loosly related to Ender's Game. Don't get me wrong, the books are amazing, but Ender feels like a different character.

You could also read Ender's Shadow, but the problem there is that it will put you down the Bean path and I think you have to read the Speaker Series before the Shadow series.

My suggestion:
1. Ender's Game
2. Ender in Exile
3. First Meetings (these are short stories, but they are awesome)
4. Speaker for the Dead
5. Xenocide
6. Children of the Mind
7. Ender's Shadow
8. Shadow of the Hegemon
9. Shadow Puppets
10. Shadow of the Giant
11. New Bean Novel coming this month?

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Kill Devil Hill » Mon Jan 09, 2012 12:58 pm

I would read Ender in Exile next. It follows the logical progression, even if the book is only so-so.

The Speaker trilogy stands on its on and it very (and disappointingly) loosly related to Ender's Game. Don't get me wrong, the books are amazing, but Ender feels like a different character.

You could also read Ender's Shadow, but the problem there is that it will put you down the Bean path and I think you have to read the Speaker Series before the Shadow series.

My suggestion:
1. Ender's Game
2. Ender in Exile
3. First Meetings (these are short stories, but they are awesome)
4. Speaker for the Dead
5. Xenocide
6. Children of the Mind
7. Ender's Shadow
8. Shadow of the Hegemon
9. Shadow Puppets
10. Shadow of the Giant
11. New Bean Novel coming this month?
But Ender in Exile has tons of Shadow references.
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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Taalcon » Mon Jan 09, 2012 1:45 pm

I may adjust as I'm going along, but this is my current thinking, for someone who intends to read the whole Ender/Bean saga:

Ender's Game
Ender's Shadow
*A War of Gifts
Shadow of the Hegemon
**First Meetings: The Polish Boy (SS)
**First Meetings: Teacher's Pest (SS)
Shadow Puppets
Shadow of the Giant
Ender in Exile
First Meetings: Investment Counselor (SS)
Speaker for the Dead
Xenocide
Children of the Mind

At this point, not knowing the content of Shadows in Flight, I'm not sure if it will contain spoilers for the 'Speaker Trilogy'. We do know that its intended sequel, "Shadows Alive" is designed to wrap up the entire saga, and be a full sequel to the Shadow line, as well as Children of the Mind.

* I included A War of Gifts here, because, as I read through them recently in this order, I found that this book does include some material that actually is useful setup-material to be more fully developed later on, such as the relationship of Peter and his Mother, and the handling and views of religious matters in the world of the Second Warsaw Pact.

** I included the stories about Ender's Parents here, because it deals with information about them that is first introduced as a story point in Shadow of the Hegemon. Knowing some of this beforehand would spoil a bit of a surprise in a first reading of Shadow of the Hegemon, but it a fun 'rest of the story' to see once 'the secret' is out.

I haven't read any of the other stories. Some I understand have been incorporated or expanded into Ender in Exile, and Mazer in Prison may eventually have material covered in the 'Earth Unaware' prequel novel(s?) currently in the works.

There are also some of the other Battle School children stories (like Pretty Boy) which I haven't read, and don't know if they contribute anything worthwhile to the fleshing out of the whole story or not. Would love to hear thoughts on that.

EDITED: As per UnDunn's comments below.
Last edited by Taalcon on Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:42 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby UnnDunn » Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:23 pm

I don't include Investment Counselor, because I understand it's been abrogated by Ender in Exile.
No it hasn't. Ender In Exile is a re-write of Chapter 15 of Ender's Game. Investment Counselor deals with a couple of fairly major issues linking Shadow of the Giant with the Speaker trilogy.

Specifically, it deals with how Ender met Jane and how Ender became a Speaker in more than just name.

Read Investment Counselor after you've read Shadow of the Giant and before you read Speaker for the Dead. It is definitely worth the read.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Taalcon » Mon Jan 09, 2012 3:35 pm

I don't include Investment Counselor, because I understand it's been abrogated by Ender in Exile.
No it hasn't. Ender In Exile is a re-write of Chapter 15 of Ender's Game. Investment Counselor deals with a couple of fairly major issues linking Shadow of the Giant with the Speaker trilogy.

Specifically, it deals with how Ender met Jane and how Ender became a Speaker in more than just name.

Read Investment Counselor after you've read Shadow of the Giant and before you read Speaker for the Dead. It is definitely worth the read.
Gotcha. I'll revise my list. I've read IC (which was originally written back in, what, 1999? For the Far Horizons anthology. I think it came out before Ender's Shadow), but not EiE. I thought I recalled reading something about some significant contradictions between Investment Counselor and Ender in Exile, leaving IC as somewhat outside the now established storyline. But, I'll take your word for it, actually having read both!

Actually, I now recall that Investment Counselor is what contradicted the original Chapter 15 of Ender's Game, and OSC holds the later material to be more correct, with a re-written Chapter 15 of Ender's Game (which is more fully expanded in the Ender in Exile novel) promised and written, but apparently not yet delivered/made public.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby UnnDunn » Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:14 pm

Actually, I now recall that Investment Counselor is what contradicted the original Chapter 15 of Ender's Game, and OSC holds the later material to be more correct, with a re-written Chapter 15 of Ender's Game (which is more fully expanded in the Ender in Exile novel) promised and written, but apparently not yet delivered/made public.
I think you're confusing Investment Counselor and Ender in Exile.

Ender in Exile is the Chapter 15 re-write. It deals specifically with Ender's journey to the first colony, his life there and the events surrounding his discovery of the surviving Hive Queen. It also tackles an unresolved plot line started in Shadow of the Giant. In the book's afterword, OSC acknowledges the retconning and says it supersedes EG chapter 15. He also rewrote EG chapter 15 to match the events of Exile, and that rewrite is available on the Intergalactic Medicine Show.

Investment Counselor takes place several hundred years after the events in Ender in Exile, when Ender turns 21 subjective years old (he's still a subjective teenager in Exile.) It develops another plot line begun briefly in Shadow of the Giant and it does some fairly major character development leading into Speaker for the Dead, but it doesn't retcon or contradict anything else in the canon.
Last edited by UnnDunn on Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby Taalcon » Mon Jan 09, 2012 5:21 pm

Actually, I now recall that Investment Counselor is what contradicted the original Chapter 15 of Ender's Game, and OSC holds the later material to be more correct, with a re-written Chapter 15 of Ender's Game (which is more fully expanded in the Ender in Exile novel) promised and written, but apparently not yet delivered/made public.
I think you're confusing Investment Counselor and Ender in Exile.

Ender in Exile is the Chapter 15 re-write. It deals specifically with Ender's journey to the first colony, his life there and the events surrounding his discovery of the surviving Hive Queen. It also tackles an unresolved plot line started in Shadow of the Giant.

Investment Counselor takes place several hundred years after the events in Ender in Exile, when Ender turns 21 subjective years old (he's still a subjective teenager in Exile.) It develops another plot line begun in Shadow of the Giant, but it doesn't retcon or contradict anything else in the canon.
I think we're just talking past each other. Investment Counselor was written and published in 1999, before there was a Shadow Series, before Ender's Shadow was even written. It does contradict material in EG, Chapter 15. (OSC notes as much in the afterward to Ender in Exile, as seen here: GOOGLE BOOKS LINK) - if it ties into Shadow of the Giant, that's because Shadow of the Giant was tying into Investment Counselor, not the other way around *grin*.

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Re: Finished Ender's Game. What's next?

Postby UnnDunn » Mon Jan 09, 2012 7:28 pm


I think we're just talking past each other. Investment Counselor was written and published in 1999, before there was a Shadow Series, before Ender's Shadow was even written. It does contradict material in EG, Chapter 15. (OSC notes as much in the afterward to Ender in Exile, as seen here: GOOGLE BOOKS LINK) - if it ties into Shadow of the Giant, that's because Shadow of the Giant was tying into Investment Counselor, not the other way around *grin*.
Heh, sorry. I get like this a lot on the internet. It's a character flaw.

I guess the resolution to this is merely to say "read Ender in Exile; It fixes everything."


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