Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Discuss all things pertaining to the EnderVerse milieu.
ptr.arkanian
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:10 pm

Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby ptr.arkanian » Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:45 am

I remember the first time I sat down and watched Avatar (the blue people one; not the asian one), I could'nt stop thinking about speaker for the dead, xenocide, and children of the mind. If you've seen the movie, tell me your comments on this:

The tree of souls is the center of Navi life on Pandora. The Navi communicate and pray to the tree of souls. Is the tree of souls much different from the father trees on Lusitania?

Character Jake Sully and his close associates work in an avatar form of the Navi, in an attempt to create peace with the natives. They learn the ways of the natives, and begin to side with the Navi rather than the company of miners. Jake and company defy the company's wishes in order to save the Navi from a terrible fate. Is this any different from what Miro, Quara and the other Xenobiologists wished to do for the piggies?

The humans who are mining on Pandora decide they must get rid of the native Navi because the center of the Navi village is built on top of a very lucrative mining site. When the Navi refuse to leave, the miners plan to destroy the Navi. See the connection between this and the little doctor blowing up Lusitania?
Share this dragon
If you do
Lucky end for
them and you
-Petra Arkanian

User avatar
Jeesh_girl15
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 851
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:23 pm
Title: Procrastination Fairy
Location: Wherever I wanna be

Postby Jeesh_girl15 » Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:56 pm

For the sake of posting because I haven't in a while, and this interests me.

I remember thinking something along the same lines when I first saw the movie. I admit, I was close to obsessed about Pandora, and the whole idea really struck me (though I wasn't one of the die-hard, kill myself because earth isn't Pandora types). I think it was the Mother Tree that struck me, as well as the destroying of the home. But I really can't remember much of my thought process from then. I'll try to watch the movie then get back with my thoughts.
You musn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling.

User avatar
Jebus
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 1299
Joined: Tue Sep 26, 2006 5:53 pm
Title: Lord and Saviour
First Joined: 07 Nov 2001

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby Jebus » Wed Jan 12, 2011 9:37 pm

I remember the first time I sat down and watched Avatar (the blue people one; not the asian one), I could'nt stop thinking about speaker for the dead, xenocide, and children of the mind. If you've seen the movie, tell me your comments on this:

The tree of souls is the center of Navi life on Pandora. The Navi communicate and pray to the tree of souls. Is the tree of souls much different from the father trees on Lusitania?

Character Jake Sully and his close associates work in an avatar form of the Navi, in an attempt to create peace with the natives. They learn the ways of the natives, and begin to side with the Navi rather than the company of miners. Jake and company defy the company's wishes in order to save the Navi from a terrible fate. Is this any different from what Miro, Quara and the other Xenobiologists wished to do for the piggies?

The humans who are mining on Pandora decide they must get rid of the native Navi because the center of the Navi village is built on top of a very lucrative mining site. When the Navi refuse to leave, the miners plan to destroy the Navi. See the connection between this and the little doctor blowing up Lusitania?


"...what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

User avatar
Jeesh_girl15
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 851
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:23 pm
Title: Procrastination Fairy
Location: Wherever I wanna be

Postby Jeesh_girl15 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 5:31 pm

Tsk, tsk, Be nice, now. The person was just mentioning what they thought about the movie. They couldn't help but see a connection to the Enderverse.
You musn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling.

Glaucon
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 5:27 pm

Postby Glaucon » Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:52 pm

Wow. Dick. I've never seen Billy Madison used for such evil before.

I can see the connection, but I hadn't considered it before. I'll definitely bring it up with my friend who I talk about Enderverse stuff with now or then. I bet we come up with more interesting connections that I'll post here if you're interested, OP. Thanks for piecing those together
-Glaucon

ptr.arkanian
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 30, 2010 5:10 pm

Postby ptr.arkanian » Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:13 am

Thank you,

I feel like I'm forgetting pieces of avatar, and I'm certain you could find more connections.
Share this dragon
If you do
Lucky end for
them and you
-Petra Arkanian

User avatar
waffleman
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 120
Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2011 5:05 pm
Location: Toronto
Contact:

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby waffleman » Wed Mar 02, 2011 6:23 am

I remember the first time I sat down and watched Avatar (the blue people one; not the asian one), I could'nt stop thinking about speaker for the dead, xenocide, and children of the mind. If you've seen the movie, tell me your comments on this:

The tree of souls is the center of Navi life on Pandora. The Navi communicate and pray to the tree of souls. Is the tree of souls much different from the father trees on Lusitania?

Character Jake Sully and his close associates work in an avatar form of the Navi, in an attempt to create peace with the natives. They learn the ways of the natives, and begin to side with the Navi rather than the company of miners. Jake and company defy the company's wishes in order to save the Navi from a terrible fate. Is this any different from what Miro, Quara and the other Xenobiologists wished to do for the piggies?

The humans who are mining on Pandora decide they must get rid of the native Navi because the center of the Navi village is built on top of a very lucrative mining site. When the Navi refuse to leave, the miners plan to destroy the Navi. See the connection between this and the little doctor blowing up Lusitania?


I got just the information for you:


Is "Avatar" based on a book?
EditHistoryDelete
No. Avatar is based on an original screenplay penned by writer/director/producer James Cameron. However, the screenplay does contain elements and concepts from several science fiction works, including The Jesus Incident (1979) by Frank Herbert and Bill Ransom, Speaker For The Dead by Orson Scott Card, and Winds of Altair by Ben Bova, to name a few.


Source: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0499549/faq#.2.1.17
I paint objects as I think them, not as I see them.
Pablo Picasso

User avatar
Kill Devil Hill
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:17 pm

Postby Kill Devil Hill » Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:49 pm

My sister just saw Avatar and, based upon what I've told her of the entire Speaker series (who knew she was listening to me!), came storming into our apartment this morning screeching, "OMIGOD SOMEBODY RIPPED OFF YOUR BOOK SERIES."
We can shed our skins and swim into the darkened void beyond
We will dance among the world that orbit stars that aren't our sun
All the oxygen that trapped us in a carbon spider's web
Solar winds are whispering, you may hear the sirens of the dead.

User avatar
TheTranskinator
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:28 pm
Location: i'm not sure... it's dark and a i hear laughing... aww crap

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby TheTranskinator » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:33 pm

Is "Avatar" based on a book?
EditHistoryDelete
No. Avatar is based on an original screenplay penned by writer/director/producer James Cameron. However, the screenplay does contain elements and concepts from several science fiction works, including The Jesus Incident (1979) by Frank Herbert and Bill Ransom, Speaker For The Dead by Orson Scott Card, and Winds of Altair by Ben Bova, to name a few.


Source: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0499549/faq#.2.1.17
I wonder why Kill Devil Hill? :P

User avatar
Kill Devil Hill
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:17 pm

Postby Kill Devil Hill » Mon Mar 21, 2011 7:50 am

I was just telling a story. Lol. I did in fact read that.
We can shed our skins and swim into the darkened void beyond
We will dance among the world that orbit stars that aren't our sun
All the oxygen that trapped us in a carbon spider's web
Solar winds are whispering, you may hear the sirens of the dead.

User avatar
TheTranskinator
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:28 pm
Location: i'm not sure... it's dark and a i hear laughing... aww crap

Postby TheTranskinator » Mon Mar 21, 2011 7:30 pm

I know, was just screwing with you lol. I really didn't think it shared that much in common. Mainly just humans getting to know an alien race with weird customs revolving around trees... okay. Maybe there's a bit :P

User avatar
Kill Devil Hill
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 63
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:17 pm

Postby Kill Devil Hill » Mon Mar 21, 2011 8:32 pm

I know, was just screwing with you lol. I really didn't think it shared that much in common. Mainly just humans getting to know an alien race with weird customs revolving around trees... okay. Maybe there's a bit :P
Apparently, it had enough in common to grab my sister's attention. Who knew she was listening? :p I've never seen it, but now I may just consider watching it despite the rather cliche-sounding storyline. :)
We can shed our skins and swim into the darkened void beyond
We will dance among the world that orbit stars that aren't our sun
All the oxygen that trapped us in a carbon spider's web
Solar winds are whispering, you may hear the sirens of the dead.

User avatar
TheTranskinator
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 22
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2011 9:28 pm
Location: i'm not sure... it's dark and a i hear laughing... aww crap

Postby TheTranskinator » Sat Mar 26, 2011 5:38 pm

It's actually a pretty good movie. The storyline is as predictable as (some analogy I couldn't think of) but the little things make it amazing. I enjoyed it :P

billy.tinkler
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2011 8:23 pm

Postby billy.tinkler » Mon Apr 11, 2011 8:31 pm

What you've hit upon isn't merely a connection between James Cameron's vision and that of Card. A lot of what you mention has roots in archetypes that are, supposedly, an inherent part of our storytelling tradition. Surely you see the appearance of the 'Mother Goddess' figure (i.e. Eywa) in stories that date further back than Ender's Game. Even the whole storyline of Avatar reeks of Pocahontas or even Dances With Wolves.

So while these connections are undoubtedly apparent, I think it's clear that they are rooted in something much older than Ender's Game.
BillyT

User avatar
Jeesh_girl15
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 851
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2009 6:23 pm
Title: Procrastination Fairy
Location: Wherever I wanna be

Postby Jeesh_girl15 » Wed Apr 13, 2011 4:13 pm

*haven't posted in forever/read Ender's series/watched Avatar in a very long time*

I'm just taking a shallow dip into this, but in the Ender series, there was no "Mother Goddess." Yes, there were Mother Trees, but there was just a network of closely-linked life forms, granted very closely-linked.

You could probably justify if Jane thought of the Mother Trees as some sort of deity, seeing how as they sustained her very being for a period of time. But Jane was never the religious type, so the matter never came up.

Now, I don't remember whether or not the Piggies on Lusitania worshiped the Father trees or just honored them. Anyone care to elaborate for my poor memory?

Anyway, just a shallow look on this subject. Really, this is just what pooped into my head. On the whole Avatar being a good movie: It was good. Not the most original story line, but it was done thoroughly. Kudos to James Cameron either way. The film made for good entertainment and a cool 2-3 hours of digital film immersion. Graphics were stellar, even if my mom almost got sick from the IMAX 3D combo.
You musn't be afraid to dream a little bigger, darling.

klugeet
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 2
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:08 pm

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby klugeet » Wed Apr 18, 2012 11:21 pm

After reading this thread, a few ideas have occurred to me. For one, all of the life on Pandora is supposed to be linked together, able to transmit thoughts, memories, emotions, etc... Isn't that kinda like how the father trees of Lusitania are connected? Also, when Jane used the mother trees to contain her auia, I remember there being something about how they started to glow... a little like the tree of souls, no?

Jhogo
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:32 am

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby Jhogo » Wed Jul 25, 2012 4:58 am

Hi there!

I know no one has posted in this thread in a while, bu I just finished reading Ender's Game, Speaker for the Dead and Xenocide, and the connection between these books, specifically Speaker and Xenocide brought to mind Avatar.

Initially it was just the whole connection the pequeninos and their Mother and Father trees, and in turn, the Fathertree's link with each other. Then came the philotes and with that the association with Aiua, or the so called will of all sentient beings. This is directly comparable to James Cameron's Eywa in Avatar, they are even pronounced the same.

Anyway, they were just my initial thoughts upon reading the books, which are excellent by the way :D

Since thinking this I did notice that Cameron doesn't hide the fact that he got a lot of inspiration from the Enderverse, but that's how mot stories are written, based on ideas already out there. I don't see any problem with that. Avatar is a good film in itself.

Cassandra
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 451
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:40 pm
Contact:

Re: Avatar in relation to Enders Game

Postby Cassandra » Wed Sep 05, 2012 3:13 am

I will say, that immediately after seeing Avatar in the theaters I was comparing it to Speaker for the Dead before I even left the parking lot. There are a LOT of similarities. More thoughts after my brain sleeps :)
"Even though faith is above reason, there can never be any real disagreement between faith and reason, since it is the same God who reveals the mysteries and infuses faith, and who has endowed the human mind with the light of reason." -The Catholic Church, Session III, Chapter IV, Canon 5 of the First Vatican Council
http://endersansible.com


Return to “EnderVerse Novels and Stories”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests