A rare occurance - JL asks for advice

[Jayelle]

I need some advice from people who have no connection to my situation, so I'm turning to you guys.

Okay, so I have a friend (I'll call her Betty). Betty has been clinically depressed for as long as I've known her (about 4 years). Recently, Betty and her husband split up. It has caused our friendship to crumble almost completely, since Paul and I were "couple friends" with her and her husband. I have tried to get together with her for coffee or something, but it hasn't really worked.
What's complicated in our relationship is that she also has been a helper in our church youth group for the past 2 years (Paul and I are the leaders/in charge), and now, in our 3rd year, she claims she still wants to help.
We have events every Friday, and she has claimed repeatedly that she will come, then doesn't show up. We counted on her last month to bring a car, and she just didn't show, nor did she answer her phone. She has proved very, very unreliable throughout our friendship.
I have told her that it doesn't matter if she comes every time, she can come when she's available. But, she emailed me to say that she feels guilty for not coming and that she would come FOR SURE to the next one and asked if there was anything she could do to help.
So, this past Friday, she did show up like she said. She asked why I didn't ask her to do anything (like bake cookies, decorate, etc) and I gave a lame excuse, but the real reason is that I can't depend on her AT ALL! Halfway through the night, she asked me if she could do anything, and I said no (because there wasn't anything for her to do at that moment), the next thing I knew, she was gone. She just left.

I want to tell her the real reason why I don't ask her to do things, that she is completely unreliable. I want to tell her that I don't know how to be friends with someone who doesn't care about me at all.
But, I'm really scared to do that because of her depression. She's attempted suicide in the past and has extremely low self-esteem. I feel sometimes like any small thing will push her over the edge and I don't want to be the one to be responsible for that, but I also feel like I'm being dishonest with myself and her about why I won't trust her with any responsibility.

Advice? Questions?

[vendor]

I take it that she is reliable enough to hold a full time job. Or else, how would she support herself. I guess she isn't a needy person, otherwise she would smother you.

Am I right?

[Jayelle]

She had a job for a few years, which she was on disability leave for (because of her depression) for about 6 months. She has now quit that job and is a student.

[vendor]

I guess the solution all depends on how much time and effort you want to invest in this "friend". Her situation doesn't sound like a weekly phone call is really going to help. If I were you, and I was REALLY concerned, I would take her under my wing and mother her until she is ready to fly on her own again. Keeping her busy will help her not think about herself or her problems.
You could also call the suicide hot-line for her and find help for your church youth group elsewhere.

If you want to save the world, she could make a decent staging point. You could always start a new church program to help others with her condition. It's possible to get a government subsidy doing something like that.

[starlooker]

Honestly, Betty is probably already somewhat aware of this. Part of her skipping out may be due to guilt. Do not make the assumption that she does not care about you -- she is just not good at showing caring through actions. Dealing with depression is difficult, time-consuming, etc. She probably has every intention of following through with actions, but can't always do it. And, even if she's aware of what happens, she might not be aware of the impact it has on you.

If she asks you again, perhaps tell her that you're aware she's under a lot of strain, so you don't want to give her additional pressure. Maybe mention one time that it happened, working under the assumption that it wasn't necessarily her fault, but at the same time, you don't want to put her in a difficult position. Or, possibly, give her some small task to do that will add to the event in a positive/meaningful way (e.g., baking cookies) so that if she does follow through she's reinforced for it by people's praise. But don't give her anything necessary so that if she doesn't follow through, your event isn't ruined and you have less bad feelings towards her.

Accept her where she is at and what she can offer you as a friend. But don't expect more until she starts to give more. Do NOT under any circumstances use the line about "not knowing how to be friends with someone who doesn't care about me at all" because that very likely is NOT the case. That's how you interpret it, but is not likely how it's intended.

Also, even if she were to try to hurt herself following a conversation, you did not do that. That's her and her depression, not you. However, in talking with folks who are suicidal but not hospitalizable, after difficult conversations it helps sometimes to have them call a friend or family member who they can spend some time with for the rest of the day, making sure that they have a plan for what to do if they're distressed, etc. If you have a conversation and you're really worried, is there someone you can call to check on her?

[Luet]

Yes, what Kirsten said.

[Syphon the Sun]

"So, I have this friend..."

You and Paul are getting a divorce! I knew it!

[Janus%TheDoorman]

You're getting the work of a college student here, so take with it the awareness that there have been hours of reflection spent examing problems I don't really have the experience to gauge.

I don't think I've ever been clincally depressed, or at least never diagnosed as such. I have, however, spent a good number of years being unreliable, confised, and unsure of a lot of things. I rather obviously can't speak for your friend, or for how things might have turned out different, but for me, I think it was a fear that my being irresponsible would lose me the people I care about, and the relationships I depended on. You obviously know your friend better than I do, but I'd say that the best course of action is just to be up front and tell her the truth about how it's affecting the friendship, but that the friendship itself isn't in danger. Feeling like she does, she's probably feeling lonely and vulnverable.

I'd suggest nudging her, hard if need be, into what she probably wants for herself, to be more responsible, and have a healthier relationship with you and others, but, if it makes sense, always try and be in the supporting, pushing posture, and not the forcing, dragging posture. Push her where she wants to go, don't drag her where you want to be.

That's just my two cents, though.