Aging as a curable ailment

Talk about anything under the sun or stars - but keep it civil. This is where we really get to know each other. Everyone is welcome, and invited!
Sparrowhawk
Soldier
Soldier
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2006 2:20 am

Aging as a curable ailment

Postby Sparrowhawk » Tue May 01, 2007 11:02 pm

http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/004218.html

This article relates to a paper by Aubrey de Grey which states: "We should view aging as ultimately curable just as cancer researchers view cancer as ultimately curable."
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of socialism is the equal sharing of miseries." - Winston Churchill

User avatar
Janus%TheDoorman
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 563
Joined: Wed May 30, 2007 8:05 am
Title: The Original Two-Face
Location: New Jersey

Postby Janus%TheDoorman » Thu Jun 28, 2007 2:30 pm

This is something that seems to be coming up more and more frequently with "solutions" varying from stopping the release of certain horomones to altering the human genome, but there's an example most of us are familiar with that we need to be wary of.

Bean, everyone's favorite little genetic manipulation reminds us of the question of what we consider aging. Now, we all have the idea of what we consider our prime, but when exactly is the time we want to stop aging? Or is it only certain procesess of aging we want to stop? Should we, as with Bean, allow our minds to grow as they do in early childhood until our other systems can barely keep up with the growth?

Truth is, I'm not very knowledgeable about biology, and someone who is would better serve to give an idea of exactly what happens to the body as it grows and ages, but I'm sure that there are many other questions that need to be resolved around this issue, before we even get into the method of doing it, or the moral quandaries that surround it.
"But at any rate, the point is that God is what nobody admits to being, and everybody really is."
-Alan Watts

Vergil
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:57 pm

Postby Vergil » Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:23 pm

All I think about is, "Would I even want to live forever?" I think I could get rather tired.
"We live, as we dream - alone..."

User avatar
Scott
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 2:33 am
Location: Omaha, NE, USA
Contact:

Postby Scott » Wed Aug 29, 2007 5:17 pm

I am no molecular biologist but from my understanding, our cells replicate by dividing. Make copies of themselves. Much like recording VHS tapes, each subsequent copy is fuzzier, hence over time our cells deteriorate. (I don't know, mitochondria, RNA whatever in the cells)

I think it is possible to prevent the deterioration of the human body, highly unnatural and unethical but one day possible in the far far future. Right now, they're just working on slowing aging I think.
Live every week like it's SHARK WEEK

jotabe
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 2105
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:59 am
Title: Leekmaster Kirbyfu

Postby jotabe » Thu Aug 30, 2007 2:33 am

Unnatural? unethical?
Please, explain.
Image

eriador
KillEvilBanned
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:02 pm
Location: North Plains, OR (read Portland)

Postby eriador » Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:44 am

I am no molecular biologist but from my understanding, our cells replicate by dividing. Make copies of themselves. Much like recording VHS tapes, each subsequent copy is fuzzier, hence over time our cells deteriorate. (I don't know, mitochondria, RNA whatever in the cells)

I think it is possible to prevent the deterioration of the human body, highly unnatural and unethical but one day possible in the far far future. Right now, they're just working on slowing aging I think.
More precisely, every time DNA replicates it becomes a little bit shorter. Eventually it chews through long bits of so-called "junk" on the ends of the helices into the actual genes.

However, aging has many other mechanisms, many of which are not understood.

jotabe
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 2105
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:59 am
Title: Leekmaster Kirbyfu

Postby jotabe » Thu Aug 30, 2007 9:41 am

Yep, that's the mechanism that gives the expiration date of a cell, the moment where the cell runs out of chromosome ends (telomers), due to successive shortening due reproduction.

But all along the cell's life, along the many times it will reproduce, the genes become damaged. Copy processes makes mistakes, always. The information becomes corrupted. Eventually the genes are so unreliable that proteins produced are useless. In this moment, through a certain mechanism, the cell is given the order to die, which she does, unless she has become cancerous.
There are other mechanisms that cause genetic damage; one of the best known is the oxidization of the celular medium, due to the presence of free radicals (mainly molecules with ionized oxigen) (this is why diet poor in sugars helps you stay younger, most of the free radicals come from faulty burning of sugar).

Our body ages because cells information is starting to get corrupted, and the proteins produced are of bad quality. We die when the cells that need to be killed are so many, or when the the presence of bad proteins is so pervasive, that eventually lead to a critical failure of the whole system.

*** Waiting to be corrected by our resident biologist *** ^_-
Image

User avatar
Scott
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 2:33 am
Location: Omaha, NE, USA
Contact:

Postby Scott » Thu Aug 30, 2007 3:38 pm

Unnatural? unethical?
Please, explain.
I think it is unnatural to prevent the deterioration of the human body. Physical immortality is not natural.

Natural is: birth -> life -> death.

It is unethical as well. Overpopulation for one. I don't have the strength to explain right now, I'm tired :)
Last edited by Scott on Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Live every week like it's SHARK WEEK

eriador
KillEvilBanned
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:02 pm
Location: North Plains, OR (read Portland)

Postby eriador » Thu Aug 30, 2007 7:06 pm

Scott, do you believe in any medicine at all? Because if you do, that sounds like a contradiction.

User avatar
Scott
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 42
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2007 2:33 am
Location: Omaha, NE, USA
Contact:

Postby Scott » Thu Aug 30, 2007 11:57 pm

Scott, do you believe in any medicine at all? Because if you do, that sounds like a contradiction.
Yes I do believe in medicine, I see no contradiction at all. Unnatural is something that is contrary to the laws of nature, like immortality would be. I never said I was against all things that are unnatural, I was stating I am against physical immortality.

I am not against prolonging human life, I am all for it. If science can extend the life span to 150 years, fine. If scientists can slow down aging, fine... but I am against completely preventing old age.
Live every week like it's SHARK WEEK

jotabe
Toon Leader
Toon Leader
Posts: 2105
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:59 am
Title: Leekmaster Kirbyfu

Postby jotabe » Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:23 am

but, why?
Image

eriador
KillEvilBanned
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:02 pm
Location: North Plains, OR (read Portland)

Postby eriador » Fri Aug 31, 2007 11:18 am

What's the difference? How do you draw a line there?

21BRAVO
Launchie
Launchie
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu Dec 07, 2006 3:32 am
Location: BELLINGHAM, WA
Contact:

Postby 21BRAVO » Tue Oct 09, 2007 3:44 am

I think a clarification of "natural" is also in order. After all, I can suck down the most processed chunks of food and I can claim its "all natural" because every element of it is naturally found in...nature. And if we state that processing something negates its natural qualities then even sandwiches (all organic) are unnatural. So, I think we all need to hear what "natural" means. Besides, some people naturally live to be REALLY old (the women in my stepbrother's family have all lived to be over 100). Natural?
Animus, Vires et Honoris


Return to “Milagre Town Square”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ahrefs [Bot], Amazon [Bot] and 51 guests