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So I'm wondering, what's the draw for Zelda? I tried playing the Gameboy game years ago, and I couldn't get myself into it.

Which one is "the gameboy one", by the way? The first Zelda game I played was Link's Awakening, which I still think is awesome, but I think a lot of people disagree with me. (I also hated Link to the Past, but I like every other one I've played) There are other games for the various gameboy platforms, though, as I understand it.

As to why... I don't have quite the hardon for the series that others seem to, but I don't think its success is anything too magical. It just has good character design, good level design, and tends to have good graphics and music (Miyamoto makes successful series; I don't find Zelda too special apart from others). Link is cool, Zelda is pretty, the gameplay is easy but very interesting. And it hasn't changed very much, but hasn't gotten stagnant -- at least, not enough for the market to notice.

Well, you know what Zelda Wii is about? Who the Link is, right?

No, I haven't seen any plot details except the one concept art that's making everyone obsess over the sword and the suggestion that the Fairy Queen is an incarnation of the sword. Is it supposed to be the Hero of Time? That'd be pretty sweet. It's a little unfair how he's completely co-opted the series, though, and now every Link is defined more or less by how they relate to the HoT.

It just has good character design, good level design, and tends to have good graphics and music (Miyamoto makes successful series; I don't find Zelda too special apart from others). Link is cool, Zelda is pretty, the gameplay is easy but very interesting. And it hasn't changed very much, but hasn't gotten stagnant -- at least, not enough for the market to notice.

I think that in itself is an immense achievement How often do you see that in such a long saga? Good developers working with simple but good material make good games... sounds easy, but doesn't happen often.

Though i have to say i haven't played Zelda since OoT.

Oh, God, the characters in Majora's Mask. The amount of involvement you get into their lives...

I need some alone time.

I hear ya. I actually give MM the same rating as OoT. They're both 9.9/10, and only because perfection is unattainable. So far, TP is on the same level. As far as OoT and MM Link's fate, he is technically the "first" Link in the timeline; it's almost 'necessary' that his spirit remain, imbuing later generations with the wisdom and power and courage (see what I did there?) needed to fulfill their destinies as his successor and defeat whatever rising evil threatened the land. He was the first; but he wasn't to be the last. That "first" Hyrule was the most overflowing with magic and power, and the first Link necessarily the most legendary of the heroes.

I'd say the NES Zeldas are the latest ones in the timeline, seeing how Hyrule apparently underwent a heavy cultural/religious change (checking the shield emblems).

I'm finding Twilight Princess to be to my liking. I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say it's the best Gamecube game they made. That might not mean much to some, but honestly the GC is a very respectable console, even today.

The draw for Zelda is simple; it seems to offer fun for almost any type of gamer. From the beginning, in its humble NES roots, it offered an experience when everything else was nothing but a way to pass the time. It's not quite an RPG, it's not quite simple action-adventure, it's a world you jump into with both feet. For some, it's the nostalgia, sure - but for others, like me, it's a game where the suspension-of-disbelief margin is incredibly wide. I buy into it every time I turn on the system. Especially with Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask and now Twilight Princess. The moment I hear those first strains of the theme, it's got me. Body and soul, I'm into it.

Yes, the Gameboy games don't have the same draw for me, but I still played them. And I had fun doing it. Of course, the Zelda series was a legend even before the N64, but from Ocarina on, it became something more than legend - it's transcendent. That's not hyperbole. It's beyond a simple "game." The music and sound effects; the familiar settings, characters, and concepts; the timeless story of good-vs-evil, of heroism, courage, and wisdom against despotism and lust-for-power; the easy way you get sucked into the fantasy; the way it creates a world you fall in love with, and then threatens it in a way that makes you want to save it more than anything.. it's got everything you could ever ask for in gaming.

Ocarina, Majora and Twilight, even now, on consoles 1-and-2 systems behind the current generation, far exceed, in my opinion, any offering currently available. The closest thing that even approaches it for me was the modern incarnation of the Prince of Persia series. The second two, Warrior Within and Two Thrones, were highly polished products that incorporated dramatic story, excellent gameplay that went above and beyond the standard formula to weave in platforming and combat effortlessly, and came close to creating that sense of 'epicness' that comes easily to Zelda titles. But even those, my favorite of the modern era, fall frustratingly short.

Nothing that's coming out interest me. Nothing piques my excitement. Sure, they've got their positives. I can get down with a good FPS or tactical-shooter, but I could keep coming to the Zelda well for the next decade. I'll say it - the Legend of Zelda is the greatest video game series of all time, and some of it's individual titles are the greatest individual games of all time. Of my top 5 games from any console, Zelda holds 3 spots. On the top 10, it holds 6. It is gaming's answer to Star Wars, fantastic, epic and engrossing.

Wow...

Zelda being my favorite video game series, I can't really add to that. Except to say, play Windwaker. I was put off by the graphics at first, but I ended up getting used to them and being okay with it. And WW, while probably not as good, can definitely hold its own with OoT, MM and TP. Maybe it was because I didn't expect all that much from it, but I enjoyed it thoroughly.

Much as I like LoZ, I find the Metroid series much more engaging and fun. The gameplay has is more intense, the combat more interesting, the world more detailed (every creature, enemy and structure has a detailed description and analysis) and the stories are less similar to each other and remarkably well told given the lack of dialogue.

I tried to play Metroid Prime on the Wii, but i just can't get past the control scheme... i get lost in the starting base, and can't help running in circles, can't move where i want to...
I need keyboard and mouse

I guess that will be another videogame landmark i can't enjoy due to controls (like resident evil).

I must say, the five or six hours I've played TP (I was hanging out at a buddies house and they were showing off their wii) were the best time I ever had with a Gamecube game (though I was on the wii, lol) and probably the best videogame I'd played since Ocarina/Mask

I really should replay Majora's Mask, that game was intense.

I will say that I think the Gameboy Zelda is probably the hardest Zelda I've ever played (other than zelda2 which doesn't really count).

On the other hand I am still fanatically in love with the original Legend of Zelda. The game is complex, but just simple enough that you can hold the entire game in your mind and play through it quickly, there's a powerful nostalgia value (like Mich there were epic fights over who got to play Zelda between my brother and I, and I couldn't even read at the time. We usually settled on a compromise where five year old Adam would tell eight year old Phil where to go and what to do since he couldn't remember and would get lost trying to find dungeon 2). I can't do that with A Link to the Past, which I often feel is a hair too complex (though I don't think so about Ocarina)

but I think, of the Zelda's I've played, Ocarina of Time is the absolute best if the series. There are only two games I've logged as many hours on, FFIII and Chrono Trigger. I've completely filled out every single element of the game twice. and played through just for fun (not worrying about every heart piece and the wallets and beetles etc) a couple times.

so Zelda's in order of difficulty:

1. Link's Awakening
2. Majora's Mask
3. A Link to the Past
4. Ocarina of Time
5. Legend of Zelda

n/r Zelda 2 (stupid f****** game gahhh!)

how I rate them on a favorites scale:

1. Ocarina of Time (10 of 10, pretty much the second best game of all time behind Chrono Trigger)
2. The Legend of Zelda (10 of 10)
3. Majora's Mask (9 of 10)
4. A Link to the Past (9 of 10)
5. Link's Awakening (8 of 10)

I guess that will be another videogame landmark i can't enjoy due to controls (like resident evil).

Ugh. For a while I tried to fool myself into thinking that the RE controls were like that because it simulated the difficulty of controlling oneself under stress - there were plenty of times something would burst out around a corner and I'd have to take a second to calm down and remember how to work the controls.

Did anyone play RE5? For more than 10 minutes? At least RE4 had the decency to give you half an hour to get used to the controls and learn the ropes of the game before putting you up against hordes of zombies that you just have to try and survive.

I'm fairly certain that OoT and MM are 1 and 2 in the timeline, everything else either being in successive generations, alternate realities or, in the case of Link's Awakening, a dream-realm.

The Link and Zelda of OoT and MM are the first ones; they are the prototype's for archetypes - it's another reason the games are such a draw; they're chock full of vivid archetypes and classic conflicts.

Someone mentioned OoT/MM Link's "tragic" life. I just wanted to touch on that part. Not that I disagree - he certainly does endure a great struggle, and experiences a traumatic series of events. But that's who he is - The Hero of Time. It's what he was born to do. He didn't really "belong" with the Kokiri. He wasn't one of them. He didn't have a fairy before the events, so not to have one after (though he would have, of course, developed a deep friendship with Navi), would not have fazed him. Why? For exactly the reason I just mentioned, and were mentioned before - he's gone through so much. The peaceful, beautiful land of Hyrule covered in the dark shroud of Ganon's tyrannical rule. A life-or-death struggle for the fate of a multitude of peoples and regions. Again - that's who he is. He's the Hero. He didn't belong with the Kokiri, because he was from Kakariko - and, as it's shown, Kakariko was a Sheikah village opened to Hylians. Link is, therefore, most likely a Sheikah descendant. He's the antithesis to Ganon - the dark Prince of the Gerudo to Link's brave Prince of the Sheikah, the guardians of the Hyrulian royal family. He overcomes so much, there's no way that he'd let his life be "tragic". Yes, he doesn't truly "belong", and we see him sadly trudging towards Termina in MM in search of his dear friend - but remember, he's a child at the time. He grows in to it, to be sure. Especially after the events of MM, he has to come to a realization of who and what he is - he knows by now that he can't have a "normal" life. He's got a destiny, one that obviously includes staying close to keep a watchful eye on Hyrule (evidenced by the fact that his spirit is still there, watching, even generations later in Twilight Princess.) Is this "tragic" in some definitions? Perhaps. But we don't really know what it was like for him after MM. Maybe he found Navi; maybe he acted as caretaker for the Great Deku Tree's seedling, "child" of his other friend the Great Deku Tree. Maybe he maintains friendship with the Princess (maybe even more...?) Certainly, Saria is around somewhere, his close friend from Kokiri? Epona, his ever-loyal steed, is with him. The Gorons and Zoras respect and admire him in his role. Fact is, we just don't know. Only one person does. Shigeru Miyamoto. Maybe someday soon he'll show us.

I tried to play Metroid Prime on the Wii, but i just can't get past the control scheme...

Dude, just.... Super Metroid. Metroid and Metroid II I think are fun, too, but Super Metroid is... well, it's the modern metroidvania. (And so is some castlevania game, probably)

I haven't played any Prime, but maybe I will someday. That zero-suit s*** makes me wary, though.

I don't know if anyone here has been following news on the Nintendo 3DS, but I've got to say it's looking pretty awesome. Among other big titles it's going to have an enhanced remake of Ocarina of Time.

That's right, OoT in the palm of your hands!

It looks like the 3DS will be able to pull off GameCube/PS2 level games. I know that the PSP has been doing that for years, but I (and many others) still opted for a DS. The 3DS may bring the DS's awesome library plus PSP's power, plus more feature that are still being revealed.

Uhh, yeah, the 3DS looks like it could be surprisingly awesome. 3D without glasses, handheld, a really aggressive game lineup...too bad all my gaming money will be going to the music games for my 360 (I still can't decide between Rise of the Six String and Rock Band 3)

Man... new Zelda, new Goldeneye, new Metroid, Fable 3, new Fallout, new Knights of the Old Republic, new Assassin's Creed, Gran Turismo 5, the 3DS, new Kirby, Civ 5.

I've resisted MMOs for quite a while now, but... I may just fall back into the Abyss for The Old Republic, and the week of October 19-26 sees so many good games come out this year. It's like the second coming of the Golden Age.

Man... new Zelda, new Goldeneye, new Metroid, Fable 3, new Fallout, new Knights of the Old Republic, new Assassin's Creed, Gran Turismo 5, the 3DS, new Kirby, Civ 5.

I've resisted MMOs for quite a while now, but... I may just fall back into the Abyss for The Old Republic, and the week of October 19-26 sees so many good games come out this year. It's like the second coming of the Golden Age.

New Zelda isn't about Hero of Time, after all.
It is about how the Master Sword came about, though!

It's weird, it seems like Skyward Sword is part of the origin myth of Hyrule itself, the implication seems to be that the Skyward/Master Sword was the form taken by a goddess to cleave Skyloft from Hyrule. Kinda elevates the line of the Hero from simply being the Goddess's chosen instrument in Hyrule to being something of a demi-god himself, if I've read into the plot hints correctly.

The four PC games I'm looking at buying within the next 12 months are Napoleon: Total War, Civilization V, Call of Duty: Black Ops, and Shogun 2: Total War. And the upgrade bug is biting me bad!

And by the way, the Total War series is the best RTS series of all time.

I'm just going to randomly throw this out there:

I think the God of War series rivals Legend of Zelda.

And I think Kratos could kick Link's ass.

God of War has just about the worst story ever. A spartan general sells his soul for power, and when it bites him in the ass he goes on a roaring rampage of revenge that, in the end of it, blacks out the sun, turns the sea into a roiling torrent of death, sets loose all the souls in the underworld, turns Sparta into an aggressor superpower, disrupts time and the lifeforce of the earth itself, and at the end of it, kills himself. Kratos basically turns the world into an abominable hellhole because he thought he got a raw deal.

So you're saying Kratos is less a hero, and more an antihero.

Yeah, I like that.

Also, you're plot assessment is wrong. His revenge for getting the "raw deal" was killing the God Of War, in the first game.

After that, he does get betrayed and then killed by Zeus, and then the rest of the games are revenge for that. The next game he gets revenge on Gaia for betraying him as well.

Furthermore, he redeems himself when he meets Pandora, and refuses to kill her to fullfill his revenge. And further redeems himself when he sacrifices himself to give hope to all the humans in the world who have to survive in that "abominable hellhole".

I think the main problem with your assertion that it "rivals Zelda" is that you don't specify what it rivals, exactly. Fun? That's, like, your opinion, man. Story? Actually debatable. Coolness? Interest? What is it, exactly, that it rivals?

I would say something like "I'll choose to interpret what you said as 'it rivals Zelda for "Suckiest game ever", hahaha!'" but I won't, since I haven't played God of War.

And if you think Kratos could beat Link, bring it up tonight, on FRIDAY NIGHT FIGHT NIGHT, YEAH!

It wasn't really an assertion, but simply what I "think", making it more an opinion.

However, I think it's as good a series as Legend of Zelda, in terms of the complete package.

And yes, I consider the plot as good as Zelda's overall one as well.

Similar to Legend of Zelda, God of War makes use of puzzle landscape. Meaning, instead of simply slashing your way through the level, you have to actually use your mind. Which is one of the things I really like about both series.

I dare say I think God Of War has better graphics, but then again it was made when graphics were better, and I haven't played Twilight Princess. More on point though, God of War has really good graphics.

The gameplay of the latest/last one is simply orgasmic, with the action button scenes integrated into the fighting.

And, Kratos is simply the epitome of bad@ss - and, again, isn't the traditional, cliche Hero.

Plus, his overall series is cooler than Link's, in my opinion.

LOl I forgot about the Fight thread. I'll bring it up, though, it's not really even a fair fight.

/inb4anyrabidzeldafans

I think I've gotten five nukes on Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2. Including a 69-2. Oh, and the resolution isn't too big, it's only 1280x1024.

Hey everyone, let's ramble:

A few weeks ago I got Deus Ex when it was on sale on steam, because many many people have been telling me it's the best game ever. (Oddly, I don't remember hearing about this game at all like 7 years ago, but okay...) I finally got myself to start playing it today.

Freaking hell.

I've spent something over 5 hours playing today before I realized "hey, I've been playing this for awhile". I wouldn't really agree with "best game ever" (so far), but that's mostly because I'm more into platforming/exploring than FPSes. Deus Ex certainly has exploring aspects, but eh, it's still an FPS.

But "best FPS ever" perhaps; and in general still a very good game so far. I'm just really annoyed by how freaking long it takes me to do anything, because I try all possible options to see what happens (there are so many options! and the game is pretty versatile for it's time in how it responds to the player doing random s*** like I like to do). And trying to get into all these areas is annoying... do you ever get to a point where you can just buy lockpicks/multitools/etc? It seems like there's only so many lockpicks available in the first mission / Liberty Island, for instance, so I have to make all these choices about what I get and what I leave behind. Bah, decisions.

I really should stop doing that and just go with it and enjoy the ride. The level design and gameplay all seems very well done (and I love the UI style), and plot is probably good too if I stopped doing everything five times and just let it get on with the story.

I also like rearranging furniture and moving stuff around probably way too much. Throwing a lamp/trophy/houseplant at a friendly soldier and them responding "sir, that's against protocol" (or whatever it is) leaves me laughing for too long every single time.

Only negative points I can think of... a few details of controls were a bit underexplained at the beginning, I feel. Though it's fine after you just try stuff out for a bit. The direction of missions isn't always as clear as it should be, either. The "tool belt" system is cool, but the actual non-"belt" inventory management I find awkward. Also, why the hell can I not view passwords/etc that are in my 'notes' at the same time as looking at a prompt for said password?! I am actually writing them down on post-it notes so I can read them while I enter them in, which is ridiculous.

okay, that's enough.

zero, all I have to say is:

Yesssssssssssss.

Perhaps you now understand the "reinstalling" meme.

By the way, that game allows you to kill anyone. ANYONE. And it will account for it later, if they were important enough.

Sequel is not so good. The plot is interesting enough, I suppose, but there are way too many other problems.

The prequel, soon to be released? I have high hopes.

But yes, possibly the best FPS ever. Single-player FPS, almost definitely.

By the way, that game allows you to kill anyone. ANYONE. And it will account for it later, if they were important enough.

Actually, yeah, I forgot to mention this. This game doesn't have any of that "you can't kill children" crap that fallout 3 had.

A few NPCs so far have ridiculously high HP, though, apparently. I thought that bum from the first mission was invulnerable, since he didn't go down after I used up all of my ammo. But everyone is killable... hm, that does make this interesting.

I also forgot to mention my tendency to get a bit lost (a side-effect of trying to explore everything). A minimap or something would've been nice.

By the way, that game allows you to kill anyone. ANYONE. And it will account for it later, if they were important enough.

Why, Mich. Why must you lie.

Zero, your link leads to a dead end.

Is there anybody else who still loves the old Atari-style games? Millipede, Asteroid, Digdug, Food Fight, Berzerk, etc.? Even Joust, for all its lunacy?

Pitfall! Trying to think what else I used to play. There was a boxing game (It was probably called "Boxing"). I remember playing Pole Position quite a bit. And I will throw Missile Command out there for good measure.

We didn't have an Atari but a TI 99-4A which played Atari type games. I liked A-Maze-ing, Moon Patrol, Jungle Hunt, Hunt the Wumpus, Alpiner, etc.

Missile Command, Asteroids, and any recent developments on those lines always hook me in. Probably why I immediately spent the $10 on Beat Hazard as soon as I had played the demo.

In my enormous amount of free time, I had the chance to get around to playing the majority of, and beating, Persona 4. That game made me feel the most weeaboo I have ever felt in the history of time, but it was fun and good and I wish I had the endurance to use my New Game Plus, but there are other games to play.

Like FFX. I'm doing the Ultimate Blitzball Challenge (only using the original Blitz team you get) and it's turning out to not be as hard as it first seemed it would be.

Zero, your link leads to a dead end.

Darn gamefaqs, not allowing linking to their bandwidth-hungry text files. Trying... this. Mich, same question.

Edit: and yeah, atari games were cool. I remember enjoying "decathlon" and "combat", specifically, but I haven't played anything like them recently.

It wasn't a lie... it was more of an misdirection and exaggeration due to being pressed for time.

Or I might have been mixing up who you can kill in Deus Ex with who you can kill in Morrowind. Haha, stupid Vivec.

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